Re: COHOUSING-L digest 723
From: Andy King (akingwebreference.com)
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 19:28:11 -0600
how can i unsubscribe?

>                           COHOUSING-L Digest 723
>
>Topics covered in this issue include:
>
>  1) Re: A personal note
>       by fertilezone [at] ebox.oo.net
>  2) Re: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>       by Sanda Everette <severette [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>  3) Re: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>       by Sanda Everette <severette [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>  4) Re: Consensus Fallbacks
>       by Stevenson/Bitner <lilbert [at] concentric.net>
>  5) Re: paying for sweat equity
>       by Rowena Conkling <rowenac [at] worldnet.att.net>
>  6) RE: paying $ for sweat equity
>       by "Rob Sandelin" <floriferous [at] email.msn.com>
>  7) Joint work yes, paid work -caution
>       by Lynn Nadeau <welcome [at] olympus.net>
>  8) RE: paying $ for sweat equity
>       by Stevenson/Bitner <lilbert [at] concentric.net>
>  9) Aging in Place
>       by Virginia Moreland <vmoreland [at] mindspring.com>
> 10) Labor systems
>       by "Rob Sandelin" <floriferous [at] email.msn.com>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 8 Jan 1999 17:49:03 -0800
>From: fertilezone [at] ebox.oo.net
>To: Stevenson/Bitner <lilbert [at] concentric.net>
>Subject: Re: A personal note
>
>Liz Stevenson wrote:
>
>>..At the beginning of December, my husband, .. lost his job of
>more than 9 years. Meanwhile, I've been an at-home mom for five
>years and needed to get employed right away, so I'm temping.
>
>Hello Liz,
>
>You helped us with Bay area Coho info. during our move from
>Seattle.  At the moment we are desperately looking for Berkeley's
>new name and any other East Bay communities near Fremont,
>San Ramon, Walnut Creak.  Any thoughts? Anybody?
>
>Since we are still living with relatives in the SF bay area and
>making some progress toward work, I'd just like to pass on the
>methods that worked so far, and wish you the best during your job
>transition.
>
>After being in the SF bay area for 5 weeks, we've made the
>security check stage for a $20k yr. food service job and qualified for
>a 3rd interview in a $35-40k yr. job. in Fremont :)
>
>All these jobs are direct, and the best opportunities have all come
>from the same Web Site http://www.eastbayworks.org/
>Eastbay Works Job Seeker Services
>
>Most of my interviews came from the ability call a person directly
>and from the EastBay works web site above.  I also faxed, &
>emailed resumes in droves, but untold numbers of these blind
>fax/emails must fall into some kind of black hole.  A direct phone
>line / voice message & post interview thank you letter has worked
>much better for us.  This direct phone-call principle might also
>apply to the on-line classifieds, such as:
>
>SFGate: Who's Hiring?
>http://sfgate.com/whoshiring/
>
>San Jose Mercury News JobHunter
>http://classifieds.sjmercury.com/classifieds/jobhunter/indexnojava.h
>tml
>
>#1 Technical Staffing Corporation
>http://www.tech-search.com/framesetN.html?clientAgentIS=NW4
>
>You can also post resumes and do searches from
>http://www.careermosaic.com/
>
>The internet newsgroups specific to the SF bay area, may also
>help if your expertise is in either computers or related recruiting /
>technical writing
>
>a2i.ba.jobs.offered
>a2i.ba.jobs.offered.hivol
>ba.jobs.agency
>ba.jobs.contract
>ba.jobs.contract.agency
>ba.jobs.direct
>ba.jobs.offerd
>ba.jobs.offered
>ba.jobs.resumes
>alt.bestjobsusa.sfransisco.jobs
>
>My progress has been related to having direct phone contacts and
>interviewing skills, which are improving, since I bought a $45.00
>Thomas guide and stoped getting lost.
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:22:54 -0800
>From: Sanda Everette <severette [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>To: "Joseph V. Kelly" <jkelly [at] videonics.com>
>Subject: Re: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>Message-ID: <3696BD6E.4C9AFC24 [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>
>Joe,
>Well it is after 5pm and the mail is still there.  I don't know how long it
>will be.  Thanks for the offer to help me through the difficult weekend...I
>assume that means I would only have the ability to surf but, gasp, no email.
>Well we have a different solution to wean me away from the email...we are
>going to San Diego for the weekend.  I found out I don't have to work on
>Monday so that makes it even easier....we have some projects we need to do
>there. We'll be back in time for Brian to go to work on Monday and hopefully
>my email is back by then.
>
>Ana will probably be moving in over the weekend.  Please help make her
>welcome.  She may come tonight in which case, I will see her but otherwise I
>won't.  She already knows we won't be here.
>
>Pam said she could be available for meetings on Wednesdays.  That sounds good
>to me (except for the Los Prados Neighborhood meeting on the 27th.  Perhaps I
>can do both as that one is from 6-8)  So can we meet this coming Wednesday; I
>guess that is the 13th.  I'll be cooking.
>
>
>>
>> Sanda,
>>
>> don't worry. If you want, we can help you through this difficult
>> weekend.
>>
>> __________________________________________________________________________
>> Subject: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>> Author: Sanda Everette
>> Date: 1/7/99 7:12 AM -0800
>>
>> > Folks, I received this message from my ISP.  I will be without email
>> > this weekend.
>
>--
>
>Sanda and Brian Everette
>http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda
>
>San Mateo Cooperative Community
>http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda/smcc.htm
>Toward a sustainable lifestyle:
>grow some of your own food and/or know the gardener who is growing it.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:34:06 -0800
>From: Sanda Everette <severette [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>Subject: Re: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>Message-ID: <3696C00E.B006CE41 [at] ed.co.sanmateo.ca.us>
>
>Oops, again.  This mail was sent to my community group.  I don't know how
>cohousing-L got into the list....well I have an idea of how I made this goof.
>Now you know what is going on in our community and that as small as we are,
>sometimes more communication is happening by email than in person.
>
>Sanda Everette wrote:
>>
>> Joe,
>> Well it is after 5pm and the mail is still there.  I don't know how long it
>> will be.  Thanks for the offer to help me through the difficult weekend...I
>> assume that means I would only have the ability to surf but, gasp, no email.
>> Well we have a different solution to wean me away from the email...we are
>> going to San Diego for the weekend.  I found out I don't have to work on
>> Monday so that makes it even easier....we have some projects we need to do
>> there. We'll be back in time for Brian to go to work on Monday and hopefully
>> my email is back by then.
>>
>> Ana will probably be moving in over the weekend.  Please help make her
>> welcome.  She may come tonight in which case, I will see her but otherwise I
>> won't.  She already knows we won't be here.
>>
>> Pam said she could be available for meetings on Wednesdays.  That sounds
>>good
>> to me (except for the Los Prados Neighborhood meeting on the 27th.
>>Perhaps I
>> can do both as that one is from 6-8)  So can we meet this coming
>>Wednesday; I
>> guess that is the 13th.  I'll be cooking.
>>
>> >
>> > Sanda,
>> >
>> > don't worry. If you want, we can help you through this difficult
>> > weekend.
>> >
>> > __________________________________________________________________________
>> > Subject: Sanda has no email for the weekend
>> > Author: Sanda Everette
>> > Date: 1/7/99 7:12 AM -0800
>> >
>> > > Folks, I received this message from my ISP.  I will be without email
>> > > this weekend.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Sanda and Brian Everette
>> http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda
>>
>> San Mateo Cooperative Community
>> http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda/smcc.htm
>> Toward a sustainable lifestyle:
>> grow some of your own food and/or know the gardener who is growing it.
>
>--
>
>Sanda and Brian Everette
>http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda
>
>San Mateo Cooperative Community
>http://www.wordrunner.com/sanda/smcc.htm
>Toward a sustainable lifestyle:
>grow some of your own food and/or know the gardener who is growing it.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 8 Jan 99 18:32:50 -0800
>From: Stevenson/Bitner <lilbert [at] concentric.net>
>To: <Dahako [at] aol.com>,
>Subject: Re: Consensus Fallbacks
>
>>  Most of the Northeasterners in the group were knee-
>>jerk anti-gun primarily because they felt that any gun in the community would
>>undermine their security.
>I believe the term "knee-jerk" is quite loaded, and tips your hand as to
>your own bias.  It sounds to me as if Sherri has alot of responsibility
>in your group, and doesn't like meetings very much (my own conclusion,
>nothing more). Perhaps she doesn't feel that the process is working for
>her.  A group can go too far in trying to get new members in.  If they
>didn't feel welcome enough, maybe cohousing isn't for them.  It takes a
>certain amount of intestinal fortitude to live in cohousing and deal with
>thorny issues without running away.  People who can't handle it usually
>give a reason like they didn't feel welcome, instead of owning up to the
>fact that they really didn't want to give up what they consider their
>inalienable rights, but which are, in fact, luxuries of living on their
>own- i.e., three cars, lots of space, guns, roaming pets, whatever. (My
>first meeting with Southside Park Cohousing was a very contentious affair
>involving money and our architect and builder.  Everyone said at the
>evaluation that they were afraid that they scared us out of coming back.
>My answer was that, on the contrary, people who could disaggree in such a
>respectful way were people I wanted to live with.)  Treasure the people
>who are already in your community. You have to live with them.  Don't let
>desperation, either with the process or with unsold lots, fool you into
>thinking that you need specific people to be placated in order to move
>them in.  My guess is, if they had gotten their way on the gun issue,
>there would be another issue, and another, down the road that would make
>them feel "unwelcome".  Every person who we ever let into the group who
>felt that way has been a problem. *Every single one*.  All of those have
>left, or are trying to leave.  In their places, we have gotten people who
>can deal with decisions that have already been made, and respect the fact
>that we worked hard to get to those decisions.
>
>As for patronizing old members, I think that stems from new members not
>being brought up to speed, and someone needs to pick up the ball on that.
>We have a buddy policy for new members so that they won't feel like they
>keep asking stupid questions.  A volunteer takes a new member under their
>wing, and the new member can ask the buddy any and all questions without
>feeling silly.  It is a simple and very useful solution.
>
>And so, I will close by using an awful pun. Sherri, stick to your guns!
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 08:57:19 -0800
>From: Rowena Conkling <rowenac [at] worldnet.att.net>
>To: rchaet [at] mindspring.com
>Subject: Re: paying for sweat equity
>Message-ID: <36978A6E.74833D21 [at] worldnet.att.net>
>
>
>
>To what extent do you consider work other than physical labor to be "sweat
>equity"  (a funny term since there is no equit involved!)?  For instance, is
>keeping up the community web-page, labor? What about child care supervision?
>Management board duties?  Acting as community facilitators?
>
>We've had a lot of trouble dealing with this issue and finally concluded that
>some people were happy worker bees, some were resigned worker bees, and some
>were drones, and there wasn't much one could do tochange that.  At Cambridge
>Coho we have an "expectation" that everyone will contribute time to the
>community but no enforcement mechanism.  Which can create hard feelings - but
>most people really hate the idea of having "labor police" judging the value of
>others' contributions.  In reality, of course, we all know who they are :-(
>
>RowenaC at Cambridge Coho
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 08:04:53 -0000
>From: "Rob Sandelin" <floriferous [at] email.msn.com>
>To: <dmmj [at] ncal.verio.com>,
>Subject: RE: paying $ for sweat equity
>Message-ID: <000201be3ba6$bd053e80$dc9cfad0@default>
>
>
>>
>> > If there is not a clear advantage in having insiders do the
>> paid work on
>> > a project, a really clear advantage, like it would cost half as
>> much, or
>> > avoid a long education process to bring someone up to speed, then my
>> > advice is to use non-community members, and steer clear of the
>> pitfalls.
>> > You have to live together for a long time!
>
>At Sharingwood, the membership did about 70% of the construction work to
>build our commonhouse. We all pitched in to help in varies ways with no
>expectations put on any one person. It was was a great experience. In
>particular I fondly remember the day we had 11 people on the roof laying the
>roofing, 9 of which had never done any roofing before. We all became very
>empowered that day, and it was one of many highlights of my life here.
>
>Working together physically to create something together that you will use
>is an important glue. We also built our playground ourselves. When you let
>others do that stuff for you, I think you lose something important.
>
>Rob Sandelin
>Sharingwood
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 9 Jan 99 10:56:23 -0800
>From: Lynn Nadeau <welcome [at] olympus.net>
>To: "cohousing L" <cohousing-l [at] freedom.mtn.org>
>Subject: Joint work yes, paid work -caution
>Message-ID: <E0zz3XC-0002OI-00 [at] olympus.net>
>
>Lynn wrote:
>> > If there is not a clear advantage in having insiders do the
>> paid work on
>> > a project, a really clear advantage, like it would cost half as
>> much, or
>> > avoid a long education process to bring someone up to speed, then my
>> > advice is to use non-community members, and steer clear of the
>> pitfalls.
>> > You have to live together for a long time!
>
>
>Rob wrote:
>At Sharingwood, the membership did about 70% of the construction work to
>build our commonhouse. We all pitched in to help in varies ways with no
>expectations put on any one person. It was a great experience. In
>particular I fondly remember the day we had 11 people on the roof laying
>the
>roofing, 9 of which had never done any roofing before. We all became very
>empowered that day, and it was one of many highlights of my life here.
>
>Working together physically to create something together that you will use
>is an important glue. We also built our playground ourselves. When you let
>others do that stuff for you, I think you lose something important.
>
>Lynn responds:
>Rob missed my point. My caution is on the subject of paying one or two
>members hundreds or thousands of dollars for a particular task. The
>Sharingwood common house project sounds like it was volunteer work, or if
>compensated, that everyone had an equal opportunity to participate.
>I agree with all Rob said about the value of work parties and such. We in
>fact have 4400 hours of volunteer work pledged towards our common house
>construction (rough estimates gathered so we had some idea if it would
>allow us to trim the budget), and look forward to this as a great
>community-enhancing opportunity.
>
>And we may end up paying some community members for specific work beyond
>their volunteer work, but with the cautions noted.
>
>One unrelated point: Given that the first  5 households did years of
>intensive work self-developing our project, before others bought in, we
>acknowledged that with a "pioneer discount" on the lot prices, when we
>set the lot prices, of about a thousand dollars per year worked on the
>project. A token, in terms of the thousands of hours involved, but it
>felt appropriate to both old and new members. Someday that will show up
>as increased capital gains on resale, but that didn't bother us.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 9 Jan 99 11:43:33 -0800
>From: Stevenson/Bitner <lilbert [at] concentric.net>
>To: <floriferous [at] email.msn.com>,
>Subject: RE: paying $ for sweat equity
>
>I agree that building things together really helps the community in more
>ways than a cost-benefit analysis would tell you.  But we are talking
>about two different things here, and people are not being clear about the
>meaning of sweat equity.  Some people are talking about regular chores
>and others are talking about capital improvements.  I really think we
>need to define what it is before we can give each other advice about it.
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 18:16:39 -0500
>From: Virginia Moreland <vmoreland [at] mindspring.com>
>Subject: Aging in Place
>Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990109181639.0071a050 [at] mindspring.com>
>
>
>I'm posting this inquiry on behalf of some of our East Lake Commons
>members.  Many of us are concerned about people being able to stay in our
>community as they age or become ill.  All but three of our units are
>townhouses, involving two or three stories.
>
>A small committee is doing some very preliminary investigation of how we
>might provide alternatives.  For instance, our second common house is not
>designed yet, and it's been suggested that several one room efficiencies
>could be built as an attached wing.  Some of them would even like to
>provide some kind of facilitated living - such as providing three meals a
>day rather just regular community dinners. (But not going as far as true
>"assisted living.")
>
>Since North American cohousing hasn't been established all that long, my
>neighbors are especially curious about whether any special provisions for
>aging in place with additional support services have been established
>either in the longer-running European cohousing communities or other
>intentional communities in the states. Of course it would also be helpful
>to know what other "young" (or still-in-the-womb) cohousing groups might be
>planning or thinking about this for the future.
>
>I think the whole list might be interested in resonses, but you can also
>contact the person who is spearheading this investigation for us. She is
>Kathy Johnson, reachable at kathybjohnson [at] mindspring.com or (404)577-1498.
>
>Ginny Moreland
>East Lake Commons (Decatur, GA, across the street from Atlanta)
>Whose boss, when he saw an elevation rendering of my three-story townhouse,
>commented "Oh, I see you're not planning to get old, are you?"
>
>And where we're in mid-construction and my house got a roof last week!
>Lots of homes still available.
>http://members.aol.com/elakecmmns
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 9 Jan 1999 17:15:11 -0000
>From: "Rob Sandelin" <floriferous [at] email.msn.com>
>To: <rowenac [at] worldnet.att.net>,
>Subject: Labor systems
>Message-ID: <000001be3bf3$9fd0b720$dfc9fbd0@default>
>
>I changed the title of this thread since it seems to have changed direction
>away from sweat equity, which is the use of work to pay down construction
>costs.
>
>Rowena asked about the nature of how to get people to pitch in. As a self
>managed development, cohousing has some requirements for resident
>participation. How much any given participant contributes will vary,
>depending on the tasks and their life.
>
>Having seen this issue in lots of different kinds of communities, my advice
>is to be flexible in your requirements but pay attention, not to what any
>given person does or does not do, but which tasks get accomplished and which
>ones do not.
>
>The simpliest system I have seen work in several places is some variation of
>a chore board, where the tasks that are NOT getting done, get posted. If the
>task does not get done anonymously before the next community meeting, that
>task becomes an agenda item to discuss.
>
>Rob Sandelin
>Sharingwood Community
>Northwest Intentional Communities Association
>Planning our first inter-community kids festival this spring!
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>End of COHOUSING-L Digest 723
>*****************************


Andrew B. King                 internet.com LLC
andrew [at] internet.com            http://www.internet.com
Managing Editor                2020 Hogback Rd. STE #4
http://www.webreference.com    Ann Arbor, MI 48105
http://www.coolcentral.com     (734) 971-7906 v (734) 975-9184 x


  • (no other messages in thread)

Results generated by Tiger Technologies Web hosting using MHonArc.