Cohousing-L Mailing List: RE: Fwd: the failure of cohousing in the united states

[Rob Sandelin (floriferous]

A nutcase. Ignore and delete. If he persists, drop him off the list.

Rob Sandelin 

-----Original Message-----
From: Raines Cohen [mailto:rc2-coho-L [at] raines.com] 
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:14 PM
To: Developing cohousing - collaborative housing communities
Subject: Re: [C-L]_ Fwd: the failure of cohousing in the united states

On 11/15/04 8:06 PM, Chris ScottHanson <chris [at] cohousingresources.com>
wrote:

>Anyone know anything about this guy and his claims?

When I see something provocative from somebody I don't know, the first thing
I do is a web search to get some perspective - where is this person coming
from? What's the context of the comment?

A self-description in a message board he allegedly disrupted cited him as
labeling himself:

> Head prophet of the world; a future President of the United States; a
Christian - a
>pacifist; professional musician/songwriter

You may find other terms to describe him; I'll leave that to anyone who
cares to examine his record of disrupting other mailing lists and discussion
boards:

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22douglas+stambler%22&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

He sent that same letter to many communities today - we all should feel free
to discuss it here (where he can read what we have to say), but I don't see
any actual facts to base a discussion on.

He complains about "negative attitudes of people who are dominating the
cohousing movement in america at this time", yet his is the most negative
screed I've seen, and I've seen thousands of positive responses and
attitudes, after visiting dozens of communities and serving on the national
board for six years and coordinating a national cohousing conference and
helping publish Cohousing magazine and seeing every single inquiry about
cohousing for the past year. According to our database, he hasn't ever
subscribed to Cohousing magazine or made any inquiry about Cohousing to the
national association in the past decade, so he may be projecting some small
subset that he's been exposed to.

If his point on the failure rate were true, I'd certainly imagine we'd be
hearing about it here... and we wouldn't have years-long waiting lists for
openings in some communities and resale prices exceeding local market
conditions across the board (except where intentionally capped).

If his point on elitism were true, we wouldn't be seeing extensive
partnerships between Cohousing professionals and affordable housing
developers and government agencies to create permanently affordable housing
in communities, or people in communities creatively finding solutions to
help one another and break down the barriers. Please, go beyond the myths
and stereotypes to see how we're leading the way in this area.

His comment suggesting that we all set out at the beginning to achieve
agricultural self-sufficiency gives me the impression that he's talking
about something other than cohousing as we define it, because while most
communities I know supplement their common meal larder with locally grown
and raised produce, it is nowhere intended as a sole source... unlike some
other ICs (intentional communities), most cohousing communities do not have
a closed economy, people participate in the regional economy.

At Swan's Market Cohousing (Oakland, CA) where I've lived, and other urban
communities, you'd be hard pressed to say the group was trying to be "as far
away from normal society as possible", given that the community is embedded
within a mixed-use historic structure across from the convention center, a
block from the subway nexus 12 minutes from downtown San Francisco,
surrounded by shops, restaurants, an art museum, a farmer's market, and
more. You wouldn't see Hearthstone Cohousing in Denver opening their doors
to neighbors to help prevent a WalMart from going in nextdoor, and modeling
how to run effective meetings and organize. Most communities I've visited
are trying to be as connected as possible with their neighbors and the
cities/regions they are part of.

His allegations of fraud are ridiculous: nearly all the communities I'm
familiar with that got any form of subsidy or assistance are dedicated to
creating PERMANENT affordable housing, typically with "recapture" 
provisions that, in the event of a resale, redirect "profits" not to the
community, nor the first-time buyer, but back to affordable housing in the
area, if the resale price itself isn't capped and the unit kept affordable
for the next buyer. I don't believe that market-rate cohousing has received
the funding he alleges.

And his comment about today's Coho-L comment from Sunward totally misses the
point: people are using this list to share techniques for mutual support in
community. The community is not having problems staying afloat, some members
are, and the community is using this list to figure out how it can provide
the internal, temporary support necessary. They did not ask other
communities for money, but rather, for advice on how they can share their
richness and provide for one another. How many conventional condos do you
know where that kind of compassion and concern would even be considered?

This movement is all about sharing, equipping each other to do things
ourselves: creating a community where there was none before, doing
collectively what we could not acheive individually. If the commenter wants
to take the movement in a new direction, by all means, please do
so: let us see your leadership in creating new communities. If they go
further in the directions you envision, you will provide an example for us
all to emulate.

Raines Cohen
boardmember, Cohousing Association of the United States (Coho/US) expressing
personal opinions only
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