Cohousing-L Mailing List: Re: Unit SF [was Private home dishwasher: 18 vs 24 inch}

[Chris ScottHanson (cscotthanson]

9 ft ceilings!!!  At least. 

Chris ScottHanson
from my mobile
(206) 601-7802

> On Oct 25, 2013, at 11:54 AM, R Philip Dowds <rpdowds [at] comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> I agree with Taryn Leigh's general assessment of size ranges below.  I've 
> designed a lot of 400 sq ft apartment units, both 1 bdrm and studio, and 
> would note:
>   •  Studios work better than 1 bdrm at this size, but you have to figure out 
> how to handle the bed so it doesn't own the room.
>  •  Storage is always an issue.  If you have more than a minimalist array of 
> possessions, you may need a storage alcove in the basement, or else a custom 
> designed stacking system from floor to ceiling.
>  •  In-unit cooking should stay very simple, although you can get some pretty 
> good Euro-style micro-appliances.  Cooking anything elaborate is more likely 
> to happen in the common kitchen.
> 
> The unclimatized breezeway (the 8x8 3-season porch) sounds like a fun 
> innovation, but watch out:  Economies of both construction and energy savings 
> result in multi-family when the units pack close together, minimizing 
> exterior walls, circulation, etc.  Separating them out as stand-alones could 
> be more inefficient than single family homes.  If you want to send me a 
> sketch plan, I might have additional input.
> 
> R Philip Dowds AIA
> Cornerstone Village Cohousing
> Cambridge, MA
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Oct 24, 2013, at 2:54 PM, "William C. Wood" <woodwc [at] gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Just a few related questions about the possibility of a studio as small 
>> as 410 sf:
>> 
>> 1. Is there a good archive of cohousing floor plans somewhere out there 
>> in the public domain?
>> 2. Have you ever heard of connecting a modest number of individual units 
>> to the common house through something like an 8 x 8 three-season, 
>> acoustically isolating, porch on each unit?
>> 3. And, just speculating, if you could add that 8 x 8 space to a 410 sf 
>> space, would that significantly alleviate the size concern for such a 
>> small studio?
>> 
>> (from someone at the *very early* design stages of a *potential* project)
>> 
>> Bill
>> -- 
>> William C. Wood
>> woodwc [at] gmail.com
>> http://williamcwood.com
>> 
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2013 13:12:38 -0400
>> From: Sharon Villines<sharon [at] sharonvillines.com>
>> Subject: [C-L]_ Unit SF [was Private home dishwasher: 18 vs 24 inch
>> To: Cohousing-L<cohousing-l [at] cohousing.org>
>> Message-ID:<F149F371-4B86-4BD7-B567-DAE7BBBE2AAF [at] sharonvillines.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 22, 2013, at 5:08 PM, Taryn Leigh<taryn_leigh [at] hotmail.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Studios: 410 SF
>>> One bedrooms: 510 SF
>> 
>> These are extremely small. Have you lived in units this small?
>> 
>> Consider that this includes the walls, bathroom, kitchen, and closets. A 20' 
>> by 20' room becomes very small when you begin extracting those from it. The 
>> 510 SF would be much more spacious feeling as a studio. Our best floor plan 
>> and most flexible apartment is 625 SF with a bedroom and a den/dining room.
>> 
>> I've lived in a 500 SF studio. With one person it was nice but 
>> claustrophobic when I was working at home. I did not have room for both a 
>> desk and a dining room table. Windows on one side.
>> 
>> With a bedroom, one room would have no windows.
>> 
>> A 600 SF studio was significantly more livable.
>> 
>> Assume ~150 SF for the bathroom, kitchen, and storage. 410 SF would be 260 
>> SF of open floor space. A 610 SF studio would have 460 SF of open space. 40% 
>> more even though it is only 30% larger.
>> 
>> My daughter had an apartment in Manhattan built before WWII that had a ~25 
>> SF bathroom. The toilet faced the sink just inside the door. The door was 
>> about half the size of an accessible door. Even my thin daughter had to 
>> enter sideways. Once inside you could sit or stand, or step sideways into 
>> the ~4' tub. There was ~4 SF of floor space and some of that was under the 
>> sink. No storage. It had beautiful fixtures in aquamarine and was tiled very 
>> nicely. The tile was in perfect condition after 60+ years. It was good 
>> construction, well designed. Not an alteration.
>> 
>> That apartment was 450 SF. The kitchen was behind a narrow counter. The bed 
>> was a futon couch.
>> 
>> I'm all for small apartments but they can only get so small unless you live 
>> in a city where people tend to eat out and entertain out. Their unit is a 
>> hotel room.
>> 
>> 
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