Cohousing-L Mailing List: RE: Cohousing Principles and the Contradictions of Practice

[Greg Dunn (MyLists]

>>
The Cohousing Network does not claim to represent this list server
<<

On the menu of your web site, under Resources, the link that directs
people to this list server is entitled "Our Listserv". If someone were
to ask me whether I interpret that as a claim of representation, I think
I would reply (in the words of Melvin Udall in _As Good As It Gets_):
"Is there any other way to see it?"

>>
We always have the choice of developing independent mechanisms
<<

I've considered that. But precisely *because* the Cohousing Network has
thrown its representation behind this list, creating effective
competition for it would be more work than I personally care to take on.
I'm very interested in cohousing, but I'm not looking to make it a
career at this point.

>>
(although I would strongly counsel against setting up another e-mail
list that duplicates the core 
topics found here).
<<

You don't say why you so counsel, but in any event I personally feel the
vast majority of people would be better served by simply exploring
whether there are ways that *this* list could be adapted to meet a wider
spectrum of needs than to try (at this point) to create an alternative.
I'm not out to break something that's working for most of its
participants, but I had the distinct impression that at least reasonable
attempts to accommodate even minority needs is something of a
cornerstone of cohousing philosophy.

>>
This list server is not cohousing. It's a mailing list. They have very
different characteristics than coho communities, in terms of their
purpose, origins, operation, technology, evolution, and possibilities.
<<

Yes, they have different characteristics. But which of those
characteristics dictates that the basic principle of community input
into the process of defining community standards shouldn't apply here as
much as in a cohousing community?

>>
Yes. Sure, we could fill the list with messages in which we formally
hash out standards. But that would distract us from our core topics and
make the list less relevant to our core discussions.
<<

This is why God invented subcommittees.

>>
if everybody who came to this list was happy all the time - just in the 
same way that the absence of visible conflict in a cohousing community 
absolutely does not indicate that all is well there -- in fact, it's 
probably a sign that people are limiting their group interactions to 
avoid dealing with a particular person or problem.
<<

Uh-huh.

>>
So, anybody got any fun stories of how their (East Coast) communities
are 
dealing with getting snowed in?
<<

Back to relevant topics?


Greg Dunn
 


-----Original Message-----
From: cohousing-l-admin [at] cohousing.org
[mailto:cohousing-l-admin [at] cohousing.org] On Behalf Of Raines Cohen
Sent: Wednesday, February 19, 2003 6:30 PM
To: Coho-L Mailing List
Subject: Re: [C-L]_Cohousing Principles and the Contradictions of
Practice



On 2/19/03 6:06 PM, Greg Dunn <MyLists [at] gregdunn.com> wrote:

> Nevertheless, precisely
>*because* this list is the front-line of exploration of cohousing for 
>many people, including me, it seems to me that it should be managed 
>according to the principles espoused by the organization it represents.

Note that The Cohousing Network does not claim to represent this list 
server, although it and many activities that are, like it, independently

executed, are often associated with or supported by the network -- the 
latter being something we're getting better at over time.

The Network aims to represent cohousing, but does not represent, or even

operate, this list. We owe great appreciation to Fred Olson, who, in my 
book, does the work so he gets to set the rules -- we always have the 
choice of developing independent mechanisms (although I would strongly 
counsel against setting up another e-mail list that duplicates the core 
topics found here).

>To quote from the "What is Cohousing?" article on The Cohousing 
>Network's web site:  "If your community has a leader that sets policy 
>or establishes standards unilaterally, it is not cohousing."  By that 
>definition, it seems to me, this list server itself is "off-topic".

This list server is not cohousing. It's a mailing list. They have very 
different characteristics than coho communities, in terms of their 
purpose, origins, operation, technology, evolution, and possibilities.

>1. Do you feel it's necessary or appropriate to have one person with 
>absolute power to perform it?

Yes. It helps keep the list focussed on the topic we're interested in --

cohousing -- and not on the list or e-mail practices or standards or all

those other things.

>2. Do you feel it appropriate that he should do so without providing 
>any formal statement of the standards on which this censorship is
based?

Yes. Sure, we could fill the list with messages in which we formally
hash 
out standards. But that would distract us from our core topics and make 
the list less relevant to our core discussions.

>3. If you feel there should be formal standards, how do you feel those 
>standards should be created?

n/a. The community constantly defines and redefines the informal 
standards for any mailing list, and a helpful moderator senses changes
in 
those standards (often with the help of feedback provided OFF the list) 
and adapts list moderation practices accordingly.

Different people have different tolerances for different degrees of 
enforcement/looseness ("squishiness", to use your term) in regards to 
standards on different lists. I would be very surprised (and suspicious)

if everybody who came to this list was happy all the time - just in the 
same way that the absence of visible conflict in a cohousing community 
absolutely does not indicate that all is well there -- in fact, it's 
probably a sign that people are limiting their group interactions to 
avoid dealing with a particular person or problem.

So, anybody got any fun stories of how their (East Coast) communities
are 
dealing with getting snowed in?

Raines

Raines Cohen <my initials,2,dash,coho,dash,L at my first name .com>

  Member, Swan's Market Coho [Oakland, CA] <http://www.swansway.com/>
Where a neighboring "21st unit" may be available for rental soon.

  Member, Berkeley [CA] Cohousing (moving by bicycle!)
Figuring out lots of policies around sheds.

  Facilitator, East Bay Cohousing [on hiatus] <http://www.ebcoho.org/>
Reminding you to sign up for Joani's tour of Bay Area coho communities 
3/1!

  Boardmember, The Cohousing Network <http://www.cohousing.org/> Looking
forward to learning lots at the Boulder conference, Jun 19-22!


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