Cohousing-L Mailing List: Re: So what does it cost?

[Ann Zabaldo (zabaldo]

On Oct 24, 2006, at 8:34 AM, Sharon Villines wrote:

> A point I would make in regard to having a dining room large enough  
> for
> everyone to eat in -- we started with a dining room that would seat 60
> which ironically is the exact number of adults we will have when our
> current musical chairs of selling and buying is complete. What we  
> found
> is that even 50 people eating in the room is an unpleasant experience
> -- too much noise, too much work, and as a result we had very few 
> meals. When we started planning special interest meals (for want of a
> better description) we had more meals.

I have a different opinion about the lack of regular meals in our CH  
than my good neighbor, Sharon.

We lack a commitment to have regular meals.  There are quite a few  
people in our community who simply do not want to "have to cook."  We  
have a tradition in our community of not requiring anyone to do  
anything.  That includes work share and common meals.  As Joani Blank  
pointed out in an article she wrote on meals in cohousing:   
communities that expect people to participate in cooking dinner have  
a lot more dinners than those that don't.

(As Sharon noted we are having more success w/ "specialty" meals.)

NOISE abatement is absolutely key in creating a welcoming CH space.   
We have done one round of noise abatement that has made our CH much  
more pleasant than before BUT it's still noisy.

In addition we have a two story CH so it's a voluminous space.   
(There's nothing "cozy" about it.)  It doesn't start to feel  
comfortable until at least 20 people are in it -- but with that many  
people the noise factor kicks in.

Additionally, it's an irregular space which is attractive to the eye  
but a bear for meetings.  There are two large "nooks" or "bump  
outs" (sorry, I don't know the architectural terms...) in which  
people sit that are invisible and inaudible to 3/4's of the room.   
The space also lacks one long wall to affix paper during a meeting  
(we've been extremely inventive in creating ways to post newsprint!!)

Then there's the lighting ...  we have very large industrial looking  
lights which I find quite attractive but they are waaaaaay up in the  
ceiling, can't be dimmed, and as they are flourescent (spel?) they  
add a harsh tone to the room.

In terms of tables ... we did NOT adopt Chuck Durrett's guide for  
table sizes.  Consequently we have some very large, very heavy tables  
that do collapse so as to be moveable but you have to pump iron on a  
regular basis to move them. Even the smaller four person tables are  
awkward to move.

All in all, I'd say our CH is a great example of what to avoid!  I've  
learned a lot about what not to do in the future!

> Also, a good number of the people at our large meals were actually
> guests, not residents. Only 2/3 of residents might want to show up at
> any given meal, even on a holiday, and on a weekday it is closer to
> 1/3. Other communities have posted similar figures.

The 2/3rds figure for people attending meals is actually the figure  
cited in one of the cohousing books as a rule of thumb for how much  
seating and table space you will need.  For us that would be about 40  
people.  I know there are a number of communities that serve 40  
people for meals.  And I know, on holidays we've shoehorned in 50-60  
people for dinner.  The space seemed fine then as the number of  
people reduced the volume of the space to something "human size." So  
for me, it's not the number of people per se but rather does the  
space work for whatever number of people you envision in the space  
whether it's 20 or 60?
> So I would agree that you need a room large enough so everyone can
> attend a meeting but not necessarily large enough to serve a meal to
> everyone. Since move-in we have turned not quite a 1/4 of our dining
> area into soft seating areas.

I also agree w/ the above.

My two cents!

Ann Z.
Takoma Village
Washington, DC

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