Re: Energy demand is the problem - Rip offs
From: Norman Gauss (
Date: Fri, 15 Jul 2011 16:40:56 -0700 (PDT)
Ripping us off can be alleged if we believe that the absolutely essential
product we are buying is not worth the money we pay for it. 

A century ago traveling medicine men would hawk their get-well-quick elixirs
from the backs of wagons to unsuspecting people.  Much of the time these
concoctions were just mixtures of alcohol, sugar and a little flavoring.
Most of them were rip offs.

But if competing oil companies sell their gasoline to drivers who shop
around and get the performance they expect, it can hardly be regarded as a
rip off.  Whoever can sell similar products the cheapest gets most of the
business.  It's called the market, and Adam Smith wrote how efficiently
products can be made and sold in a free market.

Norm Gauss

-----Original Message-----
From: Darien [mailto:darien [at]] 
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 2:00 PM
To: Cohousing-L
Subject: Re: [C-L]_ Energy demand is the problem - Big Oil

Certainly there is intent to make large profits. Where is the boundary
between large profits and ripping us off?

Darien Payne

On Jul 15, 2011, at 12:09 PM, Norman Gauss wrote:

> We already have an alternative way to generate energy, nuclear power 
> plants.
> But, as we have learned, there is a downside to that technology.
> New technologies that Big Oil is using include greater ability to 
> drill deeper and farther out into the water.  The humongous expense of 
> getting the oil out of these hard-to-reach places is the end result of 
> Big Oil trying harder and harder to find and extract more oil.  When 
> this type of activity declines (it will because it is mining, and all 
> mines eventually decline), gasoline will begin to skyrocket in price.  
> Enjoy the cheap gasoline now because the forecast is for a leveling 
> off and decline of oil supply in the years ahead.
> Do you believe that there is a conspiracy to rip us off?
> Norm Gauss
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Karen Carlson [mailto:kcarlson2 [at]]
> Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 11:11 AM
> To: Cohousing-L
> Subject: Re: [C-L]_ Energy demand is the problem
> Super huge profits and super huge subsidies obviously haven't 
> motivated Big Oil to invest in new technologies --unless it's still 
> another carbon- based form (e.g. fracking).  If non-carbon based, 
> sustainable technologies were on the same playing field as Big Oil, 
> they could jointly produce far more energy then we've been lead to 
> believe.  How is it that some cities and countries of Europe are 
> already well down the path of becoming independent of carbon-based 
> fuels?
> Given the unending handouts to Big Oil, how can other forms of energy 
> compete? To level the playing field, we should consider taxing 
> carbon-based fuel as it comes out of the ground or crosses the boarder 
> and return all the tax money to citizens.  This plan (carbon fee &
> dividend) would off set the additional cost of fuels to poorer 
> citizens and it would build political will to develop new 
> technologies.  It would also satisfy the politicians who have signed a 
> "no new taxes" pledge.
> Karen Carlson
> Arboretum Cohousing Community
> Madison WI
> On 7/15/11 12:02 PM, Norman Gauss wrote:
>> Has it ever occurred to the critics of Big Oil that the profits made 
>> by Big Oil may benefit you and me because they can be used for 
>> exploration and development of new technologies so that we can have 
>> more
> cheap gasoline?
>> With lower profits, energy companies are less able to invest in new 
>> technologies and to explore for new fossil fuel deposits.
>> Norm Gauss
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