Cohousing-L Mailing List: Re: guns-OT

[Racheli Gai (jnpalme]

Liz wrote:

>> Plenty an honest, law-abiding citizen has come home to a child with his head
>> blown off. Gun owners can be many things, but stupidity is something that
>> gets people with guns in the house killed, whereas stupid people without
>> guns are less likely to die of gunshot wounds. Many people who get shot are
>> shot by a member of their own household.

And Matt responded:
>Children also die by various other means in insufficiently childproofed
>homes.  Swimming pools are far more dangerous on a per-capita basis.
>Safety training is important when dealing with any dangerous tools, you
>should hear me lecture friends who come to work in my woodworking shop.

Me: Just because we all have some dangerous things in our houses doesn't
entail that everything which is dangerous is, necessarily, ok  to have.  
Many people leave their homes unlocked in coho neighborhoods. With kids
entering places - not necessarily when anyone is there, and with their
insatiable curiosity - having guns doesn't seem safe to me.  Even people
who are perfectly intelligent and logical, could forget to lock a cabinet
which has guns in it; forget to put the gun in a place which is
sufficiently out of the way; forget to lock the safety mechanism on the
gun...  Forgetting  is a  simple, normal, human thing - and indeed very
many people in this country die/get injured in gun accidents.

Liz: 
>> A student of mine was in a funk this week, because her 80yo mother-in-law
>> was just killed by someone who thought he saw a coyote on his property.

Matt:
>It would be interesting to know the details.  There aren't a lot of
>places where shooting a gun in a populated area is legal.

Me:  Just because it's "illegal" means it didn't happen?

Liz:
>> And of all the men who have killed their wives and children, I think pretty
>> much 100% of them did it with guns.

Matt:
>That sounds like media hype to me.

Racheli: I also read that the overwhelming majority of homicides
(including domestic ones) are done with guns.  I guess whether  one
believes this or not depends on what reading materials and other media
outlets chooses to be exposed to/believe.  I know  that my brother in law
who is an NRA member believes what he hears  from them, and from some
other sources which I consider highly  questionable at best.  I read lefty
mags and books, and listen to  "Democracy Now".  I suppose my brother in
law doesn't consider  these to be reliable sources of info...  


>> As for rational and logical, I think that's in the eye of the beholder. I
>> don't think it's in any way rational to own a gun. If most of your friends
>> who own guns are more rational than the ones who don't, it says more about
>> your opinion than about your friends.

>I suppose there are a lot of hunters who would disagree and I know there
>are a lot of people who do target, skeet and trap shooting who would
>disagree.  There are also a few Olympic events that use guns.

I am not particulary opposed to people who engage in sports which employ
the use of guns such as those you mentioned. 
 I also think that for people to hunt so as to supplement their diet  is
not any worse than eating meat bought at the store (I am a meat eater).
I'd still prefer, other things being equal, not to have gun owners live
next to me.  (Perhaps in principle it's possible to find a way to keep the
guns real safe, but I haven't had such a discussion with anyone in real
life - so I don't know concretely whether I could be made to feel safe,
and I disagree that my fear is utterly "irrational", even though I'm sure
I bring to every issue I look at my own emotions, life experiences and
biases.  Pure "rationality" is often highly overstimated, IMO.

I don't see any reason whatsoever for anyone to own assault rifles  and
that sort of stuff, and would not like such people to live  anywhere near
me, given a choice...  In fact, I'd rather they moved  to a different
planet.


> It sounds like to me that you
>are parrotting various media positions without having actually studied
>the statistics.

The above, as well as your comments regarding how much "more rational" gun
owners are seem to me to verge on name-calling.  Let's keep it civil.

R.  (Who says: hooray for non-violence!)

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jnpalme [at] attglobal.net (Racheli Gai)
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