Cohousing-L Mailing List: Re: Dishwashers etc

[Chris ScottHanson (cscotthanson]

Kay,

This is a wonderful Post Occupancy Evaluation (POE).  Very thoughtful, and VERY 
well written.  The only thing it needs is a floor plan to go with it, and a web 
site to post it (with other POEs).  I don't know how to do that, but I know 
there are many reading here who do.

Sorry to hear about the reduced meal participation at Wasatch.  I wonder if 
other groups are experiencing something similar.

Chris
 
On Nov 19, 2010, at 8:18 PM, Kay Argyle wrote:

> 
> Wasatch Commons has a Hobart commercial dishwasher, installed in 1999. 
> 
> UPSIDES
> 
> The cycle is 90 seconds. One person on the cleanup crew is kept busy just
> loading and unloading racks. Everything goes in the dishwasher -- stemware,
> pans, cutting boards, kitchen sponges.
> 
> The water is reused for multiple cycles. Unfortunately, given how heavily
> the cost of water is subsidized here, thrifty water use is motivated
> primarily by personal environmental leanings. 
> 
> At the end of each cycle the temperature spikes to 190F. By the time dishes
> are cool enough to handle, they are dry enough to put away. Although, before
> expecting similar results, keep in mind the implications that Utah being the
> second-driest state has for our humidity. ;)  
> 
> Glasses don't get water rings and spots like in our residential dishwashers
> at home. On the other hand, eventually they develop an all-over film. A
> rinse in vinegar every few months deals with that.
> 
> We had one cook who liked to put on elaborate multicourse meals, lasting for
> hours. He typically got a big turnout, and invited outside guests as well;
> often every dish and eating utensil we own was in use. Everything had to be
> washed and dried between every course -- with the commercial dishwasher,
> only a minor delay.
> 
> DOWNSIDES
> 
> It has needed repair, I think twice. 
> 
> The dishwasher takes ten or so minutes to heat the water initially; we turn
> it on at the beginning of the meal, so it's ready as soon as the first
> diners finish.
> 
> SLC's water contains 50 ppm of calcium. Lime buildup was a problem until it
> became a standard part of shutdown to mist the interior using a spray bottle
> of vinegar. 
> 
> It's under-counter, meaning racks need to be lifted. Corelle dishes keep the
> weight down, but it isn't a job for someone with a bad back.
> 
> The dishwasher doesn't deal well with dried-on food, large chunks, or
> overcrowded racks, occasionally a problem with a new resident who is
> thinking in terms of lengthy residential dishwasher cycles. It works well to
> have diners scrape dishes into a compost bin, then drop them in bustubs of
> soapy hot water, readied before the meal, to wait until a rack is being
> loaded. 
> 
> Multiple loads coated with oily residue may necessitate a shutdown and
> restart during cleanup, to drain and refill fresh wash water. (Spaghetti
> sauce seems to be the worst offender.)
> 
> Some people insist on rinsing dishes under running water before loading (eye
> roll). I suspect the distrust arose because crews weren't emptying the
> strainer at the end of each cleanup, resulting in a recirculating
> accumulation of particles.
> 
> The worst downsides are the architect's fault, not the dishwasher's (and
> would be just as much a problem with a residential dishwasher) (and are
> particularly irritating because they are so unnecessary). 
> 
> The dishwasher is smack opposite the pass-thru to the dining room. It isn't
> particularly noisy, but given poor acoustics and residents with aging
> hearing you still can't hold a post-meal meeting during cleanup. The fridge,
> just as noisy, is on the dining room wall, and you don't hear it from the
> dining room.
> 
> The drain board topping the dishwasher has room for a single rack being
> loaded. In the few minutes it takes dishes to cool and dry, the dishwasher
> completes two more cycles -- meaning we need space as well for two racks to
> be cooling/drying.
> 
> The nearest counter is filled by the bustubs, and anyway there is a very
> large sink for pots etc. between. The next-nearest counter is on the far
> side of the kitchen, past the pantry, cookbook & vase shelves, wall ovens,
> and microwave, a long way to carry a rack full of dishes. The stove, on the
> other hand, is temptingly close; that's not a good match for either the
> burner grates (which are rusting) nor the racks (several have holes melted
> in the bottom).
> 
> Someone working at the stove stands right where the dishwasher door opens.
> You can't start washing food prep equipment, pans, etc. while finishing
> cooking, nor clean the stove while dishes are being done. From the food prep
> area you have to walk totally around the stove, or risk burns by handing
> food to the cook across its top. There is no place to set anything at the
> stove, for instance a container of pancake batter. Once the food is cooked
> you walk around the stove again, carrying large pans of scalding-hot food.
> The counter below the pass-thru is so wide you are off-balance trying to
> hand anything across, not safe when the thing is heavy and/or hot.
> 
> Our construction is slab-on-grade. We've never gotten flooring in the
> kitchen, just some anti-fatigue mats. Corelle is sturdy, but it doesn't
> survive being dropped on concrete (putting pergo in the dining room nearly
> eliminated the breakage there). 
> 
> The kitchen is in the center of the building, with no windows, and
> inadequate lighting.
> 
> If I were ripping out our kitchen (don't I wish), I'd put the dishwasher on
> a side wall or the dining room wall, forcing sound to bounce at an acute
> angle to get to the dining room. I'd put counter space on the other side of
> the dishwasher. In the wall to the dining room, I'd put cupboards accessible
> from either room. I'd enlarge the island, with the food prep sink and lots
> of counter space, so people could work facing each other instead of with
> their backs to each other, and could pass prepped food to the cook. I'd get
> rid of the counter below the pass-thru, add closable shutters, and do more
> two-sided cupboards underneath it. I'd put in linoleum and
> industrial-strength lighting and glass doors on cupboards for
> special-occasion stuff and those skylight tubes that reflect natural light
> down from the roof.
> 
> Or I'd just ask my sister to design a kitchen for us. Out of experience with
> a lot of houses (at one point she counted up 14 moves in 14 years) she knew
> _exactly_ what she wanted when her husband got close to retiring (USAF) and
> they built a place. Efficient work flow, very social, great storage, bright
> and airy and gorgeous. It would make an utterly fabulous common house
> kitchen.
> 
> Kay
> Wasatch Commons
> Salt Lake City 
> 
> 
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