Cohousing-L Mailing List: Re: Cohousing vs "traditional" self-managed community

[Elizabeth Magill (pastorlizm]

As far as resales are concerned as long as you only own 1 or 2 homes, you
can sell your home to anyone you want, and can discriminate however you
want. There is no law restricting individuals selling their homes. So
almost all resales are not subject to the fair housing laws. The owner can
say what they want and choose any buyer you want to choose.
(The HOA or LLC that is selling three homes or more IS subject to the law.
But usually the HOA does not own the home and so is irrelevant.)

Advertising is *always* subject to the fair housing laws. Technically you
must put the fair housing logo in every ad and must not imply
discrimination against the protected classes. When the law was written, it
was aimed at newspapers.
Realtors are also subject.

I worked at a newspaper (back when they were a significant source of real
estate advertising) that was taken to court over the Fair Housing Law and
had specific rules imposed as interpretations of the law. It is the
Advertising source that was held responsible for enforcing the law, not the
individual placing the ad. Thus the law is not well-suited to figure out
what to do in cases like the web where no one is checking what you put in
your ads.

For non senior housing, the concern is discrimination *against* families
with children. The invention of housing restricted to seniors was because
the law tried to set significant requirements for when housing is permitted
to discriminate against children. Thus rules for over 55 and over 62
housing must provide significant amenities, etc., in order to be allowed to
discriminate against families with children.
What this means is that anything you do to promote families is unlikely to
be found in violation.

There was a big discussion, and enforcement issue, about saying things like
"Jewish neighborhood" which was saying a protected class was welcome, but
implied that ads that *don't* say it are "non Jewish neighborhoods". The
paper I worked at was explicitly not allowed to say this phrase and others
like it. But that was because we'd been found guilty of discrimination of
advertising that didn't follow the fair housing laws.

Websites are tough. I suggest making a page that is a separate marketing
page and following the fair housing laws on that page. That means, for
example, that the percentage of black and brown people  you show on that
page must be equal to the percentage of black and brown people in your
area. For the newspaper that meant the county, but again, the specifics are
not in the law. But you can't argue that we are just showing who really
lives here, because the purpose of that argument (from the viewpoint of
marketing advertising) is to say we are white now and want to stay white.

SO my advice (I am  not a lawyer) is to have a website about your
community, and then a tab for FOR SALE and make sure those pages follow the
law.
For forming communities I personally think it's pretty hard to argue your
website is not a marketing website, but I lost that argument in our
community.

All that said, the chance of anyone questionning any ads or actions of your
community are very slight. I suggest that you have a
non-discrimmination statement, put the fair housing logo on your for sale
page, and use your communities ethics, rather than fear of the law, as your
guide for what to say in your advertising.

(I also suggest actually reading your state's laws that add sexual
orientation, professional status, etc., to the national fair housing law so
that you are making your decisions based on what the law actually says, not
based on your fear that you'll get in trouble.)

-Liz
(The Rev. Dr.) Elizabeth Mae Magill
*Join my email newsletter https://actbechurchnow.kit.com/posts
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508-450-0431


On Wed, Jun 4, 2025 at 7:28 PM Mariana Almeida via Cohousing-L <
cohousing-l [at] cohousing.org> wrote:

> Marketing a unit in cohousing is fraught in a fair housing context. You
> want to know a lot about people, but the fair housing law essentially wants
> you to know less (so you can discriminate less.)
> This is my POV, not a legal one, but here goes:
>    - If you say, "we want families with children" - this could be
> perceived as indirect discrimination on the basis of age (older people) or
> familial status (single).
>    - If you say, "we have labor requirements" - this could be perceived as
> disability discrimination.
>    - If you say, "we want racial diversity" - then you might be perceived
> as discriminating on the basis of color or race (for the race you want,
> even if it's a minority)
> I think it's possible to navigate this context, and get useful info from
> prospective people, if you're careful. For this reason, you may want to
> restrict who talks to the potential renters or owners so that they don't
> say the wrong things.
>
>    - I don't think there are any problem with saying, "we want a neighbor
> who will be friendly and participate in meals" because this doesn't seem to
> overlap with a protected class.
>    - You might be able to get away with describing demographics you have,
> and saying you have too much of it: "We have too many single white women
> over 50." Why: because you're not saying what protected class you don't
> want more of, lol.
>    - I think you're always safe describing who you are, but you go into
> unsafe territory if you're describing characteristics of who you want to
> move in.
> A safe approach is leaving things incredibly open-ended, such as a form
> that simply says: "tell me about you and anyone else in your household who
> would be living with you."
> I would love to hear from POVs from people on this important topic!
> Thanks,
> Mariana
>
> For reference, California -- my state -- protects renters and homebuyers
> from discrimination andharassment because of race, color, religion,
> national origin, ancestry, disability, sex,gender, gender identity, gender
> expression, sexual orientation, source of income,marital status, familial
> status, genetic information, age, immigration status, primarylanguage, or
> citizenship.
> https://calcivilrights.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/32/2022/12/Housing-Rights-Booklet_English.pdf
>
>
>     On Monday, May 19, 2025 at 01:14:54 PM PDT, Sharon Villines via
> Cohousing-L <cohousing-l [at] cohousing.org> wrote:
>
>  > On May 19, 2025, at 3:47 PM, Lisa Kuntz via Cohousing-L <
> cohousing-l [at] cohousing.org> wrote:
> >
> > We are wondering how we can inform potential members of what to expect
> and
> > still be compliant with Fair Housing.
>
> Being compliant with Fair Housing is simple — don’t refuse potential
> residents because they are homosexual, black, have children, etc. All the
> people Trump and his father wouldn’t rent to.
>
> One of the warnings about coping with tyrannies is don’t comply in advance
> with an executive order or presidential declaration on TV that is illegal.
> What is going on now is that the administation is threatening violence so
> people will comply without having their orders declared illegal. They are
> unlikely to apply Fair Housing to anyone but you get the idea. They would
> if it served their puposes.
>
> The Fair Housing law doesn't say what you must do, only what you must not
> do. You must not cherry-pick buyers to avoid living with people in the
> classes protected by the Fair Housing law.
>
> Sharon
> ———
> Sharon Villines
>
> “Overcoming poverty is not a gesture of charity. It is an act of justice.”
> — Nelson Mandela
>
>
>
>
>
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